And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
Thursday, February 15, 2024
Consolidated Vultee PB4Y-2 Privateer, Bu. No. 59602, in flight. The aft dorsal turret is aiming directly at the camera.
Maritime patrol is a very different game from high-altitude bombing. The RAF's Coastal Command started using Liberators as sub hunters in 1941 and wanted greater range and more space for the radar equipment. I wonder how much of the Coastal Command wish list was asked for by the USN when they drew up the contract for the Privateer. Al_in_Ottawa
About 20 years ago, there was a relatively minor brush fire not far from where I live in Southern California. I heard that teenagers caused it with fireworks.
As I was driving down the freeway that day, I heard a loud noise and looked to my left to see one of these aircraft flying low and parallel to me.
Its beautiful fuselage was bright and polished and it was certainly attention-grabbing in the bright sunlight. I learned later that it was a Cal Fire fire-suppression aircraft.
Sadly, just two or three years later (from memory) I heard that after dropping a load of suppressant on a brush fire and pulling up, its wings folded and all aboard were killed.
You're right. I was unaware of these planes being used as air tankers until I found this- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consolidated_PB4Y-2_Privateer#Privateers_in_aerial_firefighting
Apparently, it suffered the same fate as an early C-130. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqAzIgHIMtg
Blamed on stress cracks in the wing boxes. They were improved and now undergo frequent inspection. Both of these crashes happened in 2002.
I think they ditched the twin tail for gunnery clearance. Dealing with German fighters and JU-88's became a real hazard for anti-sub patrol aircraft, and whatever they ran into almost always had to be handled on their own. Somewhat common to encounter multiple ju-88 screens, which explains the heavy gun count.
A lot of multi-engine prop planes had double tails. I've always wondered whether it would make engine-out flight easier because you'd have the prop-wash of the working engine(s) flowing directly over that side's fin and rudder. Sort of like an aerodynamic power-assist to keep the aircraft straight and controllable?
I flew as copilot on the PB4Ys for Hawkins and Powers fire fighting outfit. Damn noisy machines. Going forward or rearward in the fuselage between the retardant tanks was scary. The fuel tanks were always leaking drops of fuel like a stinking rain forest. No nose wheel steering on those goofy things.
What the B-24 should have been? comments requested
ReplyDelete"Spotted enemy sub. Sank same." - countless patrol bomber radio reports during WWII
ReplyDeleteThis was the B-24, stretched for a flight engineer station, and set up for long maritime patrols.
The waist positions are blistered and have dual 50's. For vertical observation and fire? Dual guns in the nose turret, too. What a porcupine....
ReplyDeleteMaritime patrol is a very different game from high-altitude bombing. The RAF's Coastal Command started using Liberators as sub hunters in 1941 and wanted greater range and more space for the radar equipment. I wonder how much of the Coastal Command wish list was asked for by the USN when they drew up the contract for the Privateer.
ReplyDeleteAl_in_Ottawa
About 20 years ago, there was a relatively minor brush fire not far from where I live in Southern California. I heard that teenagers caused it with fireworks.
ReplyDeleteAs I was driving down the freeway that day, I heard a loud noise and looked to my left to see one of these aircraft flying low and parallel to me.
Its beautiful fuselage was bright and polished and it was certainly attention-grabbing in the bright sunlight. I learned later that it was a Cal Fire fire-suppression aircraft.
Sadly, just two or three years later (from memory) I heard that after dropping a load of suppressant on a brush fire and pulling up, its wings folded and all aboard were killed.
You're right. I was unaware of these planes being used as air tankers until I found this-
ReplyDeletehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consolidated_PB4Y-2_Privateer#Privateers_in_aerial_firefighting
Apparently, it suffered the same fate as an early C-130.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqAzIgHIMtg
Blamed on stress cracks in the wing boxes. They were improved and now undergo frequent inspection.
Both of these crashes happened in 2002.
What I intended to question is wether the high vertical tail would have improved the performsnce of the
ReplyDeleteperformance of the B-24. My father was a B-24 pilot with 454 BG, 738 sqd. He remarked it was a tough one to fly.
ReplyDeleteI think they ditched the twin tail for gunnery clearance. Dealing with German fighters and JU-88's became a real hazard for anti-sub patrol aircraft, and whatever they ran into almost always had to be handled on their own. Somewhat common to encounter multiple ju-88 screens, which explains the heavy gun count.
DeleteA lot of multi-engine prop planes had double tails. I've always wondered whether it would make engine-out flight easier because you'd have the prop-wash of the working engine(s) flowing directly over that side's fin and rudder. Sort of like an aerodynamic power-assist to keep the aircraft straight and controllable?
ReplyDeleteI flew as copilot on the PB4Ys for Hawkins and Powers fire fighting outfit. Damn noisy machines. Going forward or rearward in the fuselage between the retardant tanks was scary. The fuel tanks were always leaking drops of fuel like a stinking rain forest. No nose wheel steering on those goofy things.
ReplyDelete