And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
Sunday, September 22, 2024
Oh yeah, you'll be popular running around with that
Just another scam to scare the sheeple. They tried that at my condo. Not only was the entire board and officers replaced, the guy they hired quit after getting 4 flat tires on his truck several times.
These days the condo/HOA board prefers to go in for lawfare, sending various owners (they want to get rid of) lawyer's letters, using the condo/HOA's unlimited funds for court actions; turning innocent people into pariahs with sotto voce calumny Using "enforcement officers" can (and does) border on the unlawful
Apologies to all. I've been trying to put up a long-winded two-part reply in my defense of HOAs, and I've been unable to see both. If you're seeing multiple copies of my response, or one and not the other, then I apologize.
We moved into our first HOA neighborhood....our retirement home....about 5 years ago, and we love it. Not only is our house great for our needs, but we have lovely neighbors and like about 90% of what our HOA does.
At our previous home of 28 years (no HOA), we had a neighbor right across the street who kept Halloween decorations up year round. And not just a couple of plastic pumpkins here and there....No, these were the 12' skeletons and spiders standing in the yard. Their kids were young at the time (and if you ask me, have prison numbers in their future), and they loved Halloween more than anything. Mom and Dad just couldn't disappoint the kiddies by taking down the decorations. This went on for years and was one of the contributing factors in our decision to move. Once we'd put our house on the market and had several potential buyers balk because of the creeps across the street, we asked these neighbors if they'd take their decorations down until we sold. They refused, as is their right, but the net result was that we sold at about 12% less than what we believed our house was worth (wife is a realtor, and our price wasn't unrealistic). The freedom to live in a neighborhood where you can do what you want can come at a cost to you.
So we moved into our HOA neighborhood, and I took a seat on the HOA Board (which I have since left). I've seen our HOA both as a Boardmember and as a homeowner.
I'm just guessing here, but it looks as though the blogspot filters are seeing my consecutive and lengthy replies as spam and are prohibiting me from publishing them. I'll come back a bit later with a second and third parts to my argument.
Some thoughts on HOAs.... * It needs to be said that in almost every case, if you live in an HOA community, you have actively chosen to be there. That doesn't mean that you might not have valid complaints about your HOA, but simply that you have placed yourself there by choice. * The other side of that coin is that you always have the choice to leave your HOA neighborhood any time you like. * That is an admittedly big step to take, but you also have the right to make your complaints known. Run for office yourself; become a gadfly at HOA Board meetings; make non-emotional and factual complaints known on your neighborhood's Facebook page. There are avenues to affect change or to stop unwelcome changes....you just have to get involved. * And if you do think that none of your neighbors think that your offenses are really a big deal, and you decide to make public your complaints about the HOA enforcement of them, don't be surprised if you don't get much support. I've seen this happen more than once.
No, I won't stop. You can engage with me if you like, or you can choose to ignore what I've said here.
I have simply said that if you don't like living in an HOA community, you have the freedom to not live in one. Moreover, if you don't like how your HOA is being operated, you have the freedom to get engaged and make changes.
Aesop.... I generally put those who cannot mount an argument without resorting to ad hominem straight into my "Ignore" list, but for you, and just this once, I'll engage with you here.
You believe that I should change my handle to "azstassi", which I believe you refer to a misspelled version of "Stasi". Well done, sir. You avoided all the intellectual bother and trouble of rebutting what I actually said and immediately took your name-calling straight to Godwin.
And then you paint with the broadest of brushes and claim that "all" HOAs either have or will abuse their authority. Again, well done. You don't back up your belief one iota, but who needs an unbiased view of a topic, amirite?
One cannot be a libertarian and an HOA supporter. The resultant non-sequitur head explosion is smacked-in-the-face-with-a-frozen-mackerel obvious.
The argument from Lord Acton's axiom is self-sufficient. Can HOA's be a force for good? Certainly. Briefly. They all - in 100% of cases, inevitably - descend into gestapo madness (Godwin's nonsense be damned) and do nothing but empower Karens. I can only point to 10,000,000 internet horror stories in defense of that proposition. There are whole websites and YouTube channels dedicated to the phenomenon.
In response, you're the guy arguing "Butbutbut...".
Well-played.
No one's saying you cannot hold your opinion. Just that it's contra-factual, based on the overwhelming majority of human experience over decades. Sorry, but there it is. The argument for HOAs is like the argument in favor of the Salem Witch Trials.
Then again, there are "holy" men who choose to hammer nails through their skin, and somehow manage to acquire a convert or two as well, just as there are people who refuse to evacuate their homestead plots in the face of catastrophic natural disasters, beyond all rational remonstration.
So you do you. It's that simple. Your beef is not with me, nor any imagined ad hominem. You're simply swimming upstream against all reality. Still mostly legal to attempt in a free country, but probably not the presentation you were hoping to make.
By all means, enjoy your HOA, and may the Karens ever be in your favor. And maybe try decaf.
I was on the HOA Board at my condo for thirteen years, and President of that for eleven. In all that time, I never met, not once, ever, any person who complained - who ever - read the governing documents [these consist of the Declarations and Bylaws [these cover the bigger stuff, etc.], and the Rules & Regulations (these cover things like quiet time, parking, etc.)]. Period. Full stop.
Back when I was in the AF, I had a Squadron Commander who first let me in on the trouble with being a Squadron Commander: He spent 90% of his time dealing with problems brought to him by 10% of his people.
There is a corollary to that in living in an HOA community. Ninety percent of a community's homeowners can get by with not reading their Governing Documents because most of an HOA's rules are just common sense. If you like to walk your dog, keep it on a leash. Pick up the dog's poop, when necessary. Remove whatever trash and weeds are in your front yard when it becomes visible. Don't leave junk cars in your driveway. In short, be a good neighbor and keep up your home's Curb Appeal.
Most people...like 90%...do these things automatically because this is just the right thing to do.....they don't need to be told by the HOA's CC&Rs. And so, they can get by with not reading the rules.
But then there is that 10% who do need to be told. They're the ones who get the nasty-grams from the HOA management company, and when they fail to address the problems that have been brought to their attention, they end up paying fines.
And after they've seen that all their neighbors are not doing the things that they've been cited for having done, after they have not taken 10 minutes to simply read the rules that they've signed agreements to regarding what they can and cannot do in their neighborhood, then they complain about the "Karen's" on the HOAs.
"My name is Kareyn with a Y and you will submit to mah authoritah !!"
ReplyDeleteHAHAHA! Great South Park tie in there!
DeleteDoes it have a steel plate........??
ReplyDeleteThat should prolly be level 4, full body armor and helmet.
DeleteStill won't stop a punch in the nose.
Delete"enforcement". So he/she/it is a law officer? That makes my blood boil.
ReplyDeleteJust another scam to scare the sheeple. They tried that at my condo. Not only was the entire board and officers replaced, the guy they hired quit after getting 4 flat tires on his truck several times.
ReplyDeleteThese days the condo/HOA board prefers to go in for lawfare, sending various owners (they want to get rid of) lawyer's letters, using the condo/HOA's unlimited funds for court actions; turning innocent people into pariahs with sotto voce calumny
ReplyDeleteUsing "enforcement officers" can (and does) border on the unlawful
Be great to get some bumper stickers saying that made up. Put them on their cars and such.
ReplyDeleteI wonder why they think they’ll need a tourniquet? Hmmmm.
ReplyDeleteApologies to all. I've been trying to put up a long-winded two-part reply in my defense of HOAs, and I've been unable to see both. If you're seeing multiple copies of my response, or one and not the other, then I apologize.
ReplyDeleteazlibertarian
Sorry, I don't see any replies of your defense of HOAs. But that's okay, let's just leave it that way.
ReplyDeleteI agree but they feel the need to share.
DeleteIn defense of HOAs......
ReplyDeleteWe moved into our first HOA neighborhood....our retirement home....about 5 years ago, and we love it. Not only is our house great for our needs, but we have lovely neighbors and like about 90% of what our HOA does.
At our previous home of 28 years (no HOA), we had a neighbor right across the street who kept Halloween decorations up year round. And not just a couple of plastic pumpkins here and there....No, these were the 12' skeletons and spiders standing in the yard. Their kids were young at the time (and if you ask me, have prison numbers in their future), and they loved Halloween more than anything. Mom and Dad just couldn't disappoint the kiddies by taking down the decorations. This went on for years and was one of the contributing factors in our decision to move. Once we'd put our house on the market and had several potential buyers balk because of the creeps across the street, we asked these neighbors if they'd take their decorations down until we sold. They refused, as is their right, but the net result was that we sold at about 12% less than what we believed our house was worth (wife is a realtor, and our price wasn't unrealistic). The freedom to live in a neighborhood where you can do what you want can come at a cost to you.
So we moved into our HOA neighborhood, and I took a seat on the HOA Board (which I have since left). I've seen our HOA both as a Boardmember and as a homeowner.
.....end of part 1....
I'm just guessing here, but it looks as though the blogspot filters are seeing my consecutive and lengthy replies as spam and are prohibiting me from publishing them. I'll come back a bit later with a second and third parts to my argument.
ReplyDeleteazlibertarian
....continued from part 1....
ReplyDeleteSome thoughts on HOAs....
* It needs to be said that in almost every case, if you live in an HOA community, you have actively chosen to be there. That doesn't mean that you might not have valid complaints about your HOA, but simply that you have placed yourself there by choice.
* The other side of that coin is that you always have the choice to leave your HOA neighborhood any time you like.
* That is an admittedly big step to take, but you also have the right to make your complaints known. Run for office yourself; become a gadfly at HOA Board meetings; make non-emotional and factual complaints known on your neighborhood's Facebook page. There are avenues to affect change or to stop unwelcome changes....you just have to get involved.
* And if you do think that none of your neighbors think that your offenses are really a big deal, and you decide to make public your complaints about the HOA enforcement of them, don't be surprised if you don't get much support. I've seen this happen more than once.
....perhaps 2 more parts to go....
Maybe change your handle from azlibertarian to azstassi.
DeleteJust saying.
There are only two kinds of HOAs.
Those which will abuse their authority, and those which already have.
Period. Full stop.
"Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely." - Lord Acton
This axiom has never been disproven in all of recorded history.
Please stop
DeleteAnonymous @ 6:41
DeleteNo, I won't stop. You can engage with me if you like, or you can choose to ignore what I've said here.
I have simply said that if you don't like living in an HOA community, you have the freedom to not live in one. Moreover, if you don't like how your HOA is being operated, you have the freedom to get engaged and make changes.
azlibertarian
Aesop....
ReplyDeleteI generally put those who cannot mount an argument without resorting to ad hominem straight into my "Ignore" list, but for you, and just this once, I'll engage with you here.
You believe that I should change my handle to "azstassi", which I believe you refer to a misspelled version of "Stasi". Well done, sir. You avoided all the intellectual bother and trouble of rebutting what I actually said and immediately took your name-calling straight to Godwin.
And then you paint with the broadest of brushes and claim that "all" HOAs either have or will abuse their authority. Again, well done. You don't back up your belief one iota, but who needs an unbiased view of a topic, amirite?
I'm done with you. The last word is yours.
azlibertarian
One cannot be a libertarian and an HOA supporter.
DeleteThe resultant non-sequitur head explosion is smacked-in-the-face-with-a-frozen-mackerel obvious.
The argument from Lord Acton's axiom is self-sufficient.
Can HOA's be a force for good?
Certainly.
Briefly.
They all - in 100% of cases, inevitably - descend into gestapo madness (Godwin's nonsense be damned) and do nothing but empower Karens.
I can only point to 10,000,000 internet horror stories in defense of that proposition. There are whole websites and YouTube channels dedicated to the phenomenon.
In response, you're the guy arguing "Butbutbut...".
Well-played.
No one's saying you cannot hold your opinion.
Just that it's contra-factual, based on the overwhelming majority of human experience over decades.
Sorry, but there it is.
The argument for HOAs is like the argument in favor of the Salem Witch Trials.
Then again, there are "holy" men who choose to hammer nails through their skin, and somehow manage to acquire a convert or two as well, just as there are people who refuse to evacuate their homestead plots in the face of catastrophic natural disasters, beyond all rational remonstration.
So you do you.
It's that simple.
Your beef is not with me, nor any imagined ad hominem.
You're simply swimming upstream against all reality.
Still mostly legal to attempt in a free country, but probably not the presentation you were hoping to make.
By all means, enjoy your HOA, and may the Karens ever be in your favor.
And maybe try decaf.
Bravo.
ReplyDeleteI was on the HOA Board at my condo for thirteen years, and President of that for eleven. In all that time, I never met, not once, ever, any person who complained - who ever - read the governing documents [these consist of the Declarations and Bylaws [these cover the bigger stuff, etc.], and the Rules & Regulations (these cover things like quiet time, parking, etc.)]. Period. Full stop.
ReplyDeleteThank you for bringing that up.
DeleteBack when I was in the AF, I had a Squadron Commander who first let me in on the trouble with being a Squadron Commander: He spent 90% of his time dealing with problems brought to him by 10% of his people.
There is a corollary to that in living in an HOA community. Ninety percent of a community's homeowners can get by with not reading their Governing Documents because most of an HOA's rules are just common sense. If you like to walk your dog, keep it on a leash. Pick up the dog's poop, when necessary. Remove whatever trash and weeds are in your front yard when it becomes visible. Don't leave junk cars in your driveway. In short, be a good neighbor and keep up your home's Curb Appeal.
Most people...like 90%...do these things automatically because this is just the right thing to do.....they don't need to be told by the HOA's CC&Rs. And so, they can get by with not reading the rules.
But then there is that 10% who do need to be told. They're the ones who get the nasty-grams from the HOA management company, and when they fail to address the problems that have been brought to their attention, they end up paying fines.
And after they've seen that all their neighbors are not doing the things that they've been cited for having done, after they have not taken 10 minutes to simply read the rules that they've signed agreements to regarding what they can and cannot do in their neighborhood, then they complain about the "Karen's" on the HOAs.
azlibertarian
oxymoron= libertarian and how
ReplyDeleteHOA.. spellcheck leave it like I typed it
Delete